BlackStarBeads

I just discovered this while listing beads and headed for the Storque to see if there was an article on it. Sure 'nuf~
Thanks.

Legacy

So my vintage items should be tagged Vintage first (which I have been doing) and then Commercial second? Am I reading this right? I want to be clear on this so I'm doing it the right way. Thanks!

kfarrell

Yes, Legacy, vintage items that you have not in some way altered yourself need to be tagged with Commercial.

historicallyinspired

Wow. You learn something new every day. I had no idea that vintage category items had to be tagged commercial as well but I will be sure to make that change from now on.

RunzwithVintage

Please correct the statements that were made in this announcement --

"Sellers of supplies and vintage items already know that any commercially produced items (i.e. not made by you) must be tagged with "commercial" as the second tag."

is incorrect.

It SHOULD read

"Sellers of supplies already know that any commercially produced items (i.e. not made by you) must be tagged with "commercial" as the second tag."

It's really misleading, and could lead anyone to assume that all vintage sellers "who already know" are willfully violating the rules!!!!

When, in fact, they are announcing a new rule.

RunzwithVintage

Because, you know, the vintage bashers will now have a FIELD DAY!!!

CreativeSundries

Runz, this is the first time I've seen that--that vintage needs to be labeled commercial. It's news to me. I'm glad I saw this!!!

HueDrops

What about vintage (and even more so, antique) items which were not commercial products? Examples: home-made clothing (from patterns, significantly modified patterns, or unique design), beaded fruit, shell art, small pieces of furniture (not from a kit). Does Gen X and younger even know that until about 1965, a significant number of American middle class women made their own curtains/drapes, clothes, table linens -- even slipcovers? If these items are considered 'commercial' on Etsy because they use commercially produced materials, ummm....more confusion. I will still sit this out and wait for some kind of real resolution before openning on Etsy. Nice try, though! --ElleJay chromophiliaDOTcom

eclipse

The new prompts on the second tag are great. Very useful that they cannot enter any other tags until they specify handmade or commercial.

Will this be added to the DO's and Dont's eventually?
“DO tag your vintage items as commercial in the second tag”.

Not very many people read the forums or the Storque, but the Do's and Dont's are the binding document.

candyconnection22

If vintage is in a main category by itself, what purpose
does having the drop-down box ask if vintage is
commercial or handmade?

Shouldn't it just be vintage-then whatever it is?

If anything, more sub-categories should be added to the vintage main category and the option for tagging
(which DOES interrupt handmade) be removed.

GoTo

Great--Thanks!

eclipse

Using the commercial tag in vintage will help with exclusionary searches, so that typing "NOT commercial" will exclude all non-handmade goods. Right now you have to type "NOT commercial NOT vintage" to exclude all non-handmade items, but there are also many handmade goods with vintage as a tag describing the style or materials. So I really don't like to type "NOT vintage" because it also excludes some handmade items. This is a good solution, having one single tag that is used on all non-handmade items and is unlikely to be used on handmade items.

Legacy

Thanks for the clarification!

Could an admin give an example of what a Vintage-Handmade item would be?

candyconnection22

eclipse says:
The new prompts on the second tag are great. Very useful that they cannot enter any other tags until they specify handmade or commercial.

Since there has been so much discussion about improper tagging, doesn't this new prompt just open another door by which sellers who DO improperly tag
can just enter into the handmade aspect without ever having to add ANY additional tags?
To assume that just because the prompt is there will stop the bleed through is incorrect and that is why I suggested the removal of the "ability to tag"
in vintage and just let it stay within main and sub-categories.
Since no definition of a vintage item made from those same components has been
established, those items would need to be channeled in a different direction than the vintage category as eclipse stated, they would be considered handmade.
The prompt as it is allows for continued
mis-use.

eclipse

I believe the new prompts are to force the sellers to designate either handmade or commercial, wheras before many commercial supplies just skipped that choice and listed supplies>beads or whatever. They never stated it was handmade, but also never stated it wasn't. (which made those items immune from exclusionary searches) Now, they cannot proceed to any other tags until they specify handmade or commercial. I think fewer people will deliberately mistag a supplies item as handmade when it's not. I think the new prompts will increase the voluntary compliance with the rules. :)

A new handmade dress made from vintage fabric would go under clothing, but might have "vintage" as a tag. It wouldn't go under vintage>handmade. I don't want to exclude those items from my searches, but they were excluded if I type "NOT vintage".
Exclusionary search will eliminate bleed-through if all non-handmade items are tagged with "commercial".

candyconnection22

eclipse..
I do agree that it will help the supplies category to filter properly.

I do not agree that placing a handmade option in the vintage category will reduce tag bleed-through, it only opens the door to additional tagging problems inside vintage.

Vintage handmade is another issue as you
have addressed it as being necessary in your searches.

eclipse

I think you might have misunderstood me, I actually can't think of any item which would fit under vintage>handmade. Unaltered vintage items would be tagged with commercial, allowing them to be excluded from searches.

scenario 1: I made a dress 25 years ago and want to sell it now. I would list it under clothing, not under vintage, because I made it myself.
scenario 2: I made a dress yesterday using vintage fabric. I would also list that under clothing, with vintage as probably the third tag.(clothing,dress, vintage fabric)
Scenario 3: I buy a vintage dress and alter it, adding appliqués and stenciling. I can list this under clothing because it is hand-altered.
Scenario 4: I list an unaltered vintage dress I purchased, that was handmade by some unknown seamstress in 1950. I would tag that vintage>commercial, because it was not handmade *by me*, therefore it is commercial in Etsy's definition.

XOHandworks

eclipse- I agree
The only time a vintage category item should have the 2nd tag of handmade is if it was handmade *by me* --
Just like if I sell a handmade lampwork bead, if I didn't make it, it's still Commercial because it wasn't handmade *by me*

candyconnection22

Hi eclipse
No, I understand you perfectly.

If you do go to list something under the vintage category, you will see that there is a prompt box for the second tag which asks if the vintage item is handmade or commercial.

By your own statement:
"I actually can't think of any item which would fit under vintage>handmade"

I can't either..

I don't see why the prompt asks that question under the vintage category.

It will just lead to further problems because it is confusing to those who have vintage items to list as shown in this thread:

http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php...

candyconnection22

The prompt box under vintage is also not a "forced choice" which locks into place.
The prompt box can be clicked back off
once the handmade-commercial choice is made..thereby allowing any second tag of the sellers choice to be re-entered
and it has been used this way based on new listings I was reviewing yesterday.

http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php...